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Davybe

Following the Dress Code.

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1 hour ago, *Dancing Queen* said:
I have no wish to prove me right or you wrong I am merely stating a fact based on my own experience and based on spending hundreds of days on both P&O and Cunard ships, as both Azura and Britannia are marketed as ‘family friendly’ ships then one would expect the age range to be much lower in school holidays however this accounts for what ... 10 weeks of the year, overall I stand by what I’ve said the Queens are not full of ‘old folk’ nor are they as formal as some like to think, what they do have ( at the moment ) are standards which I and many others have seen the decline of in recent years on P&O. 
 
Feel free to contact Carnival House though as I'm sure they will be delighted ( not ) to check every cruise on every ship to give you a breakdown of statistics.

No need for me to contact Carnival House.

You claimed that you were "more than qualified to make that statement" but if you've not got any evidence to back it up, you're obviously not.

I'm sorry but your personal experiences are just that and can't be considered factual.

As for standards we are in agreement there, standards across the board not just P&O have declined especially in the food and service departments, however I personally welcome the dump down in dress codes and as a result could even be tempted by Cunard in the future.

HLM.

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I don’t think Cunard will lower standards, they are a traditional brand getting more and more unique 

ocean village springs to mind big ship, pile them high, no dress code, drink until you vomit, were they a successful? No went out of business at one point those ships were going to anchored and used a prisons.

moving with the times, does not mean lowering  of standards, and Cunard has a very loyal following with many diamond level past passengers who will keep tradition alive, with ALL age ranges.

just my opinion and I can think of others on this forum who would saythe same thing.

 

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We quite enjoy formal nights and would be disappointed if they were phased out, but maybe P&O now have too many, a maximum of 3 on a 14 night cruise would be preferable, and for longer cruises with a lot of consecutive sea days the total number should be even less, but I have no time for those who say if you don't like formal nights choose a cruise line that doesn't have any. As regards enforcement, as a bit of an anarchist I generally dislike dictated rules, but as long as the buffet provides reasonable dinners then I would hope that those who don't want to do formal would be prepared to use it on formal nights.

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34 minutes ago, Jenjen said:

I don’t think Cunard will lower standards, they are a traditional brand getting more and more unique 

ocean village springs to mind big ship, pile them high, no dress code, drink until you vomit, were they a successful? No went out of business at one point those ships were going to anchored and used a prisons.

moving with the times, does not mean lowering  of standards, and Cunard has a very loyal following with many diamond level past passengers who will keep tradition alive, with ALL age ranges.

just my opinion and I can think of others on this forum who would saythe same thing.

 

I personally believe standards in service and food have declined, not to a poor level but certainly not like they were 10/15 yrs ago. However I also accept that prices have come down so something has to give.

With regards to dress code standards, I actually welcome the news that a more casual approach is being taken by cruiselines and see that as an improvement rather than a drop in standards.

HLM.

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We are having our first cruise with Cunard this year and as we did on P&O we'll be following the dress code. On my cruise personaliser it now says Gala and Smart attire which I believe are formal and semi formal (jacket required). So I don't really think they are dumbing down just changing  the titles. It will be interesting to see what the age range will be as we usually do long cruises on P&O generally in term time.  

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We first started cruising with Cunard on the QE2 in 1997 when it was formal and semi formal and in those days semi formal meant a tie to be worn and if you were not wearing a tie on semi formal they wouldnt let you in. One gentleman turned up without a tie one night and the Head Waiter said on entering restaurant you cannot come in without a tie either return to your cabin to get one or we can lend you one and he then opened a draw with a selection of ties in. We stopped cruising with Cunard in 2002 after 6-7 cruises with them  due to other issues and moved on to other cruise lines. We only returned in 2016 because we love the Formal dress side of cruising and thought it would now be a better fit for us. If the dress code is dumbed down on our next 2 cruises we have booked with them then I am afraid I will return to other smart casual cruise lines who offer just as good a cruise and food but at a cheaper price than Cunard.

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1 hour ago, Tally said:

We are having our first cruise with Cunard this year and as we did on P&O we'll be following the dress code. On my cruise personaliser it now says Gala and Smart attire which I believe are formal and semi formal (jacket required). So I don't really think they are dumbing down just changing  the titles. It will be interesting to see what the age range will be as we usually do long cruises on P&O generally in term time.  

I believe non ripped jeans anywhere on a Cunard ship would be considered a dumping down of the dress code.

HLM.

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10 hours ago, HLM said:

No need for me to contact Carnival House.

You claimed that you were "more than qualified to make that statement" but if you've not got any evidence to back it up, you're obviously not.

I'm sorry but your personal experiences are just that and can't be considered factual.

As for standards we are in agreement there, standards across the board not just P&O have declined especially in the food and service departments, however I personally welcome the dump down in dress codes and as a result could even be tempted by Cunard in the future.

HLM.

HLM .. allow me to highlight a few observations and respond to some of your posts, yes my posts are based on experience .. aren’t most forum posts ?? people ask questions others respond all based on personal experience whether or not people take on board what is said is entirely up to them what we don't expect is someone to demand we prove what we are saying that really isn't the spirit of any forum.
I DID NOT SAY my comparison re age demographics between P&O and Cunard was FACT I said I was qualified to make that comparison having spent hundreds of nights on board both cruise lines and I stand by what I said, why would I need evidence ?? people will make their own minds up if a ship is for them I merely stated Cunard is not full of ‘old people’ as you seem to think ( may I add a statement you made even though you have never sailed with Cunard )  I have eyes in my head and I like to think I’m fairly intelligent and would know the difference between a 30 year old and a 60/70 year old so where your problem is with me saying I think I’m qualified to make that statement is beyond me, members please be aware any posts re Cunard made by HLM are hearsay or have been read on other forums which basically amounts to hearsay.
 
 
I Quote:
 
One particular post from a very well known Cunarder said a lot, if she thinks it's changing then I'm very inclined to believe it.
 
So you believe some things but not others .. I do hope you asked for evidence.
 

As the days go by it's becoming increasingly obvious that times on Cunard are a changing.

People nowadays are wanting a more casual approach Cunard have to follow or potentially lose revenue, whilst I hope they keep some of the traditional aspects of cruising I suspect this is just the start of more radical changes.

You know this for a fact do you ?? whilst I agree in time Cunard will become more casual I don’t see it happening any time soon they need their Grill passengers and the majority are their bread and butter and will definitely be against any change .. obviously I can’t provide the evidence of that other than ‘experience’ !!

Cunard in general seem to attract the older more traditional type cruiser and this is where they've been very successful in years gone by, unfortunately for them that generation are becoming fewer and far between therefore they have no option other than to target a younger audience, and that means more casual attire.

Again just your opinion and having never sailed with them you really wouldn’t know what their current client base want.

It was based on this post I responded that Cunard and P&O have a similar age demographic but of course you obviously know better or is it that you just like to nitpick ( sorry but you are becoming rather obvious )

I beg to differ, there is no way I'd accept that Cunard have the same age demographic as P&O, whilst I can accept Cunard have some younger people onboard their average age is way above P&O and that's saying something.

And if it's not to do with age why are Cunard targeting a younger audience?

Well you can differ as much as you like but speaking from ‘experience’ I tell it as it is and I would rather be guided by someone who has had the experience than someone who comments based on what they read elsewhere and actually has no experience.

Your opinion is always valued OWT, we have accept that outside of term time the age demographic goes up on all lines, but I still truly believe that overall P&O's is lower than Cunard's, hopefully DQ will prove it one way or another, if she's correct fair enough.

Ahhh yet again you show your tendencies to disagree with anything I say, I really don’t see your logic in saying ‘hopefully DQ will prove it one way or another’ why would I need to prove anything ?? anything I post on this forum is to help others or to give an insight ( my opinion ) into something they have a query about, I am not about to start adding ‘in my opinion’ as far as I’m concerned my experiences are fact as I see them, they may not always agree with what others think but we are all grown ups and can make our own minds up and the one thing I don’t do is aim to mislead people.

Time to stop ‘nitpicking’ HLM so on this occasion I will hand the floor over to you and bow out gracefully .. obviously your ‘experience’ of Cunard is far greater than mine.

 

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7 hours ago, HLM said:

I believe non ripped jeans anywhere on a Cunard ship would be considered a dumping down of the dress code.

HLM.

Please note that after 6:00pm, shorts and blue or worn denim (for men and women); sandals and sleeveless tops (for men) are not considered appropriate within the ship.

This is what it says on the Cunard website at the moment so I don't think denim will be appreciated anywhere on the ship. Unfortunately I think only 6* lines that can risk no dress code otherwise in my opinion it will all become Ocean village type cruises and I'm sure it's not just the 'old folk' who want that.

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9 hours ago, sinbad10 said:

We first started cruising with Cunard on the QE2 in 1997 when it was formal and semi formal and in those days semi formal meant a tie to be worn and if you were not wearing a tie on semi formal they wouldnt let you in. One gentleman turned up without a tie one night and the Head Waiter said on entering restaurant you cannot come in without a tie either return to your cabin to get one or we can lend you one and he then opened a draw with a selection of ties in. We stopped cruising with Cunard in 2002 after 6-7 cruises with them  due to other issues and moved on to other cruise lines. We only returned in 2016 because we love the Formal dress side of cruising and thought it would now be a better fit for us. If the dress code is dumbed down on our next 2 cruises we have booked with them then I am afraid I will return to other smart casual cruise lines who offer just as good a cruise and food but at a cheaper price than Cunard.

We started cruising with Cunard QE2 slightly earlier than you Sinbad but I agree with everything you say, there were no casual nights back in the 90's,  if the codes weren't adhered to then people simply weren't admitted and of course back then there was no option to eat in the buffet, we also sailed on the Crown line which was a subsidiary of Cunard and even in Australian waters they still upheld the dress codes.

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4 minutes ago, Pesky Pirate said:

I’m sorry to be a killjoy and I appreciate that a point is being made but the above is very hard to read whilst being struck in red.

Apologies Pesky but I wanted my points to stand out and 'red' grabs attention.

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9 minutes ago, Pesky Pirate said:

I’m sorry to be a killjoy and I appreciate that a point is being made but the above is very hard to read whilst being struck in red.

I didn't find it difficult and to be fair to Dancing Queen I don't blame her for seeing red.;) I think someone who is a diamond member on Cunard will have more knowledge about the age demographic than someone who has never cruised with Cunard.

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10 hours ago, *Dancing Queen* said:
HLM .. allow me to highlight a few observations and respond to some of your posts, yes my posts are based on experience .. aren’t most forum posts ?? people ask questions others respond all based on personal experience whether or not people take on board what is said is entirely up to them what we don't expect is someone to demand we prove what we are saying that really isn't the spirit of any forum.
I DID NOT SAY my comparison re age demographics between P&O and Cunard was FACT I said I was qualified to make that comparison having spent hundreds of nights on board both cruise lines and I stand by what I said, why would I need evidence ?? people will make their own minds up if a ship is for them I merely stated Cunard is not full of ‘old people’ as you seem to think ( may I add a statement you made even though you have never sailed with Cunard )  I have eyes in my head and I like to think I’m fairly intelligent and would know the difference between a 30 year old and a 60/70 year old so where your problem is with me saying I think I’m qualified to make that statement is beyond me, members please be aware any posts re Cunard made by HLM are hearsay or have been read on other forums which basically amounts to hearsay.
 
 
I Quote:
 
One particular post from a very well known Cunarder said a lot, if she thinks it's changing then I'm very inclined to believe it.
 
So you believe some things but not others .. I do hope you asked for evidence.
 

As the days go by it's becoming increasingly obvious that times on Cunard are a changing.

People nowadays are wanting a more casual approach Cunard have to follow or potentially lose revenue, whilst I hope they keep some of the traditional aspects of cruising I suspect this is just the start of more radical changes.

You know this for a fact do you ?? whilst I agree in time Cunard will become more casual I don’t see it happening any time soon they need their Grill passengers and the majority are their bread and butter and will definitely be against any change .. obviously I can’t provide the evidence of that other than ‘experience’ !!

Cunard in general seem to attract the older more traditional type cruiser and this is where they've been very successful in years gone by, unfortunately for them that generation are becoming fewer and far between therefore they have no option other than to target a younger audience, and that means more casual attire.

Again just your opinion and having never sailed with them you really wouldn’t know what their current client base want.

It was based on this post I responded that Cunard and P&O have a similar age demographic but of course you obviously know better or is it that you just like to nitpick ( sorry but you are becoming rather obvious )

I beg to differ, there is no way I'd accept that Cunard have the same age demographic as P&O, whilst I can accept Cunard have some younger people onboard their average age is way above P&O and that's saying something.

And if it's not to do with age why are Cunard targeting a younger audience?

Well you can differ as much as you like but speaking from ‘experience’ I tell it as it is and I would rather be guided by someone who has had the experience than someone who comments based on what they read elsewhere and actually has no experience.

Your opinion is always valued OWT, we have accept that outside of term time the age demographic goes up on all lines, but I still truly believe that overall P&O's is lower than Cunard's, hopefully DQ will prove it one way or another, if she's correct fair enough.

Ahhh yet again you show your tendencies to disagree with anything I say, I really don’t see your logic in saying ‘hopefully DQ will prove it one way or another’ why would I need to prove anything ?? anything I post on this forum is to help others or to give an insight ( my opinion ) into something they have a query about, I am not about to start adding ‘in my opinion’ as far as I’m concerned my experiences are fact as I see them, they may not always agree with what others think but we are all grown ups and can make our own minds up and the one thing I don’t do is aim to mislead people.

Time to stop ‘nitpicking’ HLM so on this occasion I will hand the floor over to you and bow out gracefully .. obviously your ‘experience’ of Cunard is far greater than mine.

 

I appreciate the effort you've put in to this, but all you've done is simply repeat what you've said already in your previous posts, one thing you are correct on is that I've not sailed Cunard and these are just my opinions based on what I've read and observed from other so called prolific Cunarders just like you, so by questioning me you are also questioning them and their experience and opinions.

Just to add to this particular point that those on the 'other site' in which I've been reading appear to be vastly more experienced than you, and their opinion totally contradicts yours, strange wouldn't you say?

Any way the problem you have is that when you make sweeping statements such as "more than qualified to make that statement", you do so without providing the evidence to substantiate the fact, all you've done is exactly what you accuse me of, basing it on your opinion only.

I'll repeat myself again just like you, I said "there is no way I'd accept that Cunard have the same age demographic as P&O" whether or not I've sailed with Cunard or not makes no difference, it's just my opinion. If you can prove to me with official statistics regarding the age demographic then please do prove me wrong, I can take it and I'll even bow out with my tail between my legs.

As for nitpicking, I was under the impression forums such as this are about opinion, experiences and debate if you accuse people of that everytime you don't agree then perhaps you should not get involved in such threads, just my opinion of course.

I appreciate you've bowed out of the thread but I thought I'd reply anyway. 

HLM

Edited by HLM

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9 hours ago, Tally said:

Please note that after 6:00pm, shorts and blue or worn denim (for men and women); sandals and sleeveless tops (for men) are not considered appropriate within the ship.

This is what it says on the Cunard website at the moment so I don't think denim will be appreciated anywhere on the ship. Unfortunately I think only 6* lines that can risk no dress code otherwise in my opinion it will all become Ocean village type cruises and I'm sure it's not just the 'old folk' who want that.

Please note Tally from Cunard below, I also note yours states not appropriate would be "blue or worn denim" that suggests to me that certain denim jeans will be permitted, just like it states below.

"Of course, if you prefer to spend your evenings in more relaxed attire, feel free to dress casually as you visit any of the following venues: Kings Court or Lido Buffet, Golden Lion, Casino, Carinthia Lounge, Winter Garden/Winter Lounge and G32 or Yacht Club. Non-ripped jeans are appropriate, but please refrain from wearing shorts, sports attire, swim wear or sleeveless t-shirts outside of the gym, spa and deck spaces.

HLM.

 

Edited by HLM

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3 hours ago, HLM said:

Please note Tally from Cunard below, I also note yours states not appropriate would be "blue or worn denim" that suggests to me that certain denim jeans will be permitted, just like it states below.

"Of course, if you prefer to spend your evenings in more relaxed attire, feel free to dress casually as you visit any of the following venues: Kings Court or Lido Buffet, Golden Lion, Casino, Carinthia Lounge, Winter Garden/Winter Lounge and G32 or Yacht Club. Non-ripped jeans are appropriate, but please refrain from wearing shorts, sports attire, swim wear or sleeveless t-shirts outside of the gym, spa and deck spaces.

HLM.

 

Well that's not what it said their website. However I've checked my cruise personaliser and yes that's what it says as you've quoted. Perhaps they should update their website. If I might say I do find it odd that you take some people's word for things and not others. I didn't expect you to take mine as I have yet to have my first cruise with Cunard but why are you so determined to make another poster look as if they don't know what they are talking about?  As you say forums are about debate and opinion. Dancing Queen is giving her opinion on experience you are simply quoting others. I'm  afraid It does seem like nit picking to me.:huh:

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Goodness me why such heated exchanges I started cruising wth the old QE 2 a long time ago, not all staterooms had bathrooms to sail the med was a dream, nobody talked about age of passengers, service, drink prices etc, you just felt lucky now so many gripes As a diamond member, I can say, world club cocktail party, 1st officers cocktail party WILL Be Formal,

A dress code makes packing less of a problem, because you know, which nights of your holiday will require formal dress, and the suggestion that younger cruisers want less formal I would not agree with, middle age cruisers may want to, but from experence I have never met a the younger complain about having formal nights.

Just my opinion, 

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35 minutes ago, Tally said:

Well that's not what it said their website. However I've checked my cruise personaliser and yes that's what it says as you've quoted. Perhaps they should update their website. If I might say I do find it odd that you take some people's word for things and not others. I didn't expect you to take mine as I have yet to have my first cruise with Cunard but why are you so determined to make another poster look as if they don't know what they are talking about?  As you say forums are about debate and opinion. Dancing Queen is giving her opinion on experience you are simply quoting others. I'm  afraid It does seem like nit picking to me.:huh:

No nitpicking, simply asking for DQ to back up her statement that's all, after all she did challenge my opinion and I think I have the right to ask for proof.

And to be honest all the other things I've read seem to have been correct,  just like the quote I posted to you.

HLM.

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12 minutes ago, Jenjen said:

I have never met a the younger complain about having formal nights.

 

And I wouldn't expect them to complain either, but after Carnival appear to have asked the question the replies seem to indicate that given the choice they'd rather be more casual if possible, hence the reason for the change.

HLM.

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23 minutes ago, HLM said:

No nitpicking, simply asking for DQ to back up her statement that's all, after all she did challenge my opinion and I think I have the right to ask for proof.

And to be honest all the other things I've read seem to have been correct,  just like the quote I posted to you.

HLM.

Do you ask everyone for proof? Will you need proof from me if I make a comment about Cunard after my cruise? How would you know if the quote you posted to me was correct, as it's only on the cruise personaliser not on Cunard's website.

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51 minutes ago, Tally said:

Do you ask everyone for proof? Will you need proof from me if I make a comment about Cunard after my cruise? How would you know if the quote you posted to me was correct, as it's only on the cruise personaliser not on Cunard's website.

It is on Cunard's website but not on the UK site as yet, it's on the American site.

I don't need to ask everyone for proof only those who claim to be qualified to prove otherwise.

HLM.

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One should only give opinions on any subject through their OWN experiences and not to question others and think that they are experts just by reading other forums. Would never dream of commenting on any cruise line or ship if I hadnt sailed on either. 

Edited by sinbad10

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57 minutes ago, sinbad10 said:

One should only give opinions on any subject through their OWN experiences and not to question others and think that they are experts just by reading other forums. Would never dream of commenting on any cruise line or ship if I hadnt sailed on either. 

If we were all the same the forum would be boring.

HLM.

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58 minutes ago, sinbad10 said:

One should only give opinions on any subject through their OWN experiences and not to question others and think that they are experts just by reading other forums. Would never dream of commenting on any cruise line or ship if I hadnt sailed on either. 

Totally agree sinbad10, it's only boring when people quote second hand information.

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19 minutes ago, towny44 said:

Totally agree sinbad10, it's only boring when people quote second hand information.

Second hand maybe, but factual none the less.

If it weren't for this information you'd all still be saying Cunard have only changed the wording.

HLM.

P.s Just thought I'd check your started posts and found this little gem, what was that about second hand information?

 

 

Edited by HLM
Added P.s

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